Re: OODB & MCL

[e@flavors.com (Doug Currie, Flavors Technology, Inc.)]

At  9:46 PM 94.04.06 -0700, John Sotos wrote:
>Last week I asked about the use of object-oriented databases with
>MCL.  So far there's been not a peep from or about anyone who has
>done this.  The silence could be interpreted a couple ways.  Any
>opinions?

Here's a peep:

There is wood; is is available on cambridge.apple.com. I have not used it.

There is Itaska... some people (Expertelligence?) have used a client-only
version on MCL. Itaska tells me that a full version is not feasible until
MCL supports light weight threads.

Flavors has an OODB in MCL; we probably cannot sell/donate it. We had a
need for an OODBMS to use with Coral Common LISP in 1988. After
investigating the alternatives we chose to use GBase from Graphael, a
French company with a US subsidiary of the same name. Graphael dropped the
ball, and we ended up porting GBase to the Mac ourselves. We have rights to
use it but no rights to sell it. Graphael eventually became (in the US) ODB
Inc. (Cambridge, MA), and then ADB Inc., and now they have a product,
Matisse, which probably doesn't run on the Mac either.

Here are details...

GBase is based on the Property Driven Model, but is truly an OODB. It has
objects with classes, methods, and properties. Terminal properties can be
any LISP object, and can have multiple values. Structural properties are
pointers to other OODB objects, and can also have multiple values or a
fixed multiplicity. All structural properties are "typed." GBase supports
transactions, object caching, and "entry points" which are external keys.
It has its own "fasdump" and "fasload" code.

We bought GBase from Graphael (France) with the promise it would be ported
to the Mac, and made multi-user. It was running on LISP Machines at the
time (1988). Graphael (US) was unable to do the port, so we got source code
and an unlimited binary license. We ported GBase to the Mac in 1989, and
have done a couple of major overhauls since. The most recent overhaul added
a CLOS front end. We no longer store methods in the database itself.
Unfortunately, we have not had the time/incentive to add multi-user
capability.

Flavors (that's me) uses this third-generation Gbase as an integral and
invisible component in its products. This is the only way we're allowed to
distribute GBase under the agreement with Graphael.

Graphael (US) is defunct. Some French company probably owns the assets, but
I don't know for sure. Hence my dilemma with selling/donating it. At one
point in time a US company, Object Data Base (ODB), Inc., was established
by Graphael (France) to sell a product called Matisse. It had an optional
GBase front end, but Matisse did not run on the Mac. I do not know ODB's
status, although I recently saw reference to Matisse offered by a company
called ADB.

I have been encouraging Itaska and Apple to get together to make the Itaska
OODB available on the Mac. It is a CLOS based multi-user OODB. It needs
lightweight threads to run, e.g., stack groups. Two years ago Gary Byers
and Alice Hartley agreed to add stack groups to MCL 2.1 -- in fact Gary did
the code but too late to include in the 2.0 testing/release process -- I'm
still waiting; Gary and Alice are gone; Oh well. Apple remains aware of the
need. Call Sandy Miezwa at Itaska 612/851-3155 to see how her efforts with
Apple are coming. I have offered Flavors' services to do/help the Itaska
port to MCL based on our GBase/MCL experience and continued interest in
finding a MCL based multi-user OODB.

Regards,

e