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Re: contents of clim-library as of 92/09/09

    Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1992 10:01 EDT
    From: Jeff Morrill <jmorrill@BBN.COM>

      Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1992 12:37+0200
      From: Vincent Keunen <nrb!keunen@relay.eu.net>
  
      MCLers look at the clim demo and immediately throw it away because "it
      has nothing to do with the mac".  And they are not totally wrong.  And
      they won't look at it a second time.  So it's urgent to change this.
  
    I think the clim demos have gone a long way to giving clim a bad
    first impression.  I don't know whose job it would be, but clim's
    reputation might be greatly enhanced by:

     1 A less trivial lisp listener, to make lisp-machine hackers like
       John Mallery happy.
     2 Something that shows good integration with UNIX and Motif/OpenLook,
       like a CLIM version of the "xman" documentation browser.
     3 Something that looks so much like a "regular" Mac application that
       you can't tell clim is underneath; I had a version of C++ for the Mac
       that was distributed with demo code for a really simple text
       editor (similar to "Edit").

    CLIM (and Lisp!) might really catch on if (2) and (3) were easy.
    Along the way we might learn some things about clim.

I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record.

The very small number of people implementing CLIM are so busy just
implementing CLIM that the CLIM demos do not get the attention they
deserve.  This situation is unlikely to change.  If anybody wishes to
write good CLIM demos and donate them to the cause, that would be
terrific.  I would also like to point out that in some ways it is
better if someone besides a professional CLIM implementor implements
some non-trivial demos, because that person is likely to use CLIM in
different ways than we implementors, which will help to find problems
in CLIM.  The truth is that (2) and (3) should be very easy in CLIM 2.0;
if they are not, I would like to know.

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